Mandrels Home Made - Im here thanks to Krysia's Link

[Fin]

Hi All,
Well Ive found your forum from our URL links tracker on our ebay store.  I must say I wondered what Frit-Happens was all about, So popped in to see  

Well   I never even knew our 316L TIG Welding rods were used in your hobbie/business and to be honest Im still unsure how you use them...
My business is in the Stainless Steel Exhaust and Automotive market so this is new ground for me

Now Im not trying to openly sell bits and bobs on your forum. But I would like to understand exactly what you need. Would be great to know how I can tailor what I sell to help out.

Answers to the following questions would be a big help

TIG Welding rods(we use/sell quality TIG rods that and not coated and have no flux , What material's do you use? I only sell 316L Stainless (thats food grade / Marine Grade Stainless) at the moment but have all grades and every material available to us So what do you use/need?

Welding rod size, our rods are a full meter in length and 1.628mm in diameter. What do you use/need?


What sort of quantity do you need per order? Currently we sell tubes of 100 at a time, again what do you need?>

Any answers would be a big help

I look forward to the replys
Cheers
Fin
Dynoflow UK

[Krysia@No98]

Oh this made me chuckle!

I have a bit of a hectic morning, but I will try and give you a breif overview during the day, if no one beats me to it 

[Lush!]

Hi Fin

We use 316L rods cut down into approx 10" lengths as mandrels - we dip the end in a slip-like substance to prevent the glass from sticking to the rod, then wind molten glass onto the mandrel to make glass beads.

The thickness of the mandrel determines the size of the hole through the centre of the bead. 

There are a few fairly standard thicknesses that we tend to use most of:

1.6mm
2.0mm
2.3mm or 2.4mm
3mm
3.2mm
4.0mm
5.0mm
6.0mm

Does that help? 

[sarah t]

and can have no flux etc or everything goes bang !!!.........

smooth ends nice 

mixed lots or pic and mix would be good 

[Krysia@No98]

Hiya

Right I am fairly new to this so I might get a few bits wrong!

Most of us here do 'Lampworking', this is a/the process of manipulating hot glass into different shapes.  Everything from free standing structures to beads via marbles.  This can can be done either 'off mandrel' or 'on mandrel'

A mandrel is quite simply a rod of metal that you can make a structure on.  Due to the temperature that the glass melts and the way that some glasses contain metals in them (this is what gives them their colours) steel is good because it has a higher melting point then the glass.  The working temperature of glass is around 500-600.  The melting point being closer to 600 and the point that you can actually manipulate the glass into shapes closer to 520.  (roughly  )  That said people have burned thorough the mandrels.

Most people on here that work with glass make beads.  So most of them will work 'on mandrel'.  This way there is already a whole in the bead    (I have been asked by a few people how do I get the hole in the bead - it's kinda there by default)  Those that make marbles for example tend to work completely 'off mandrel' so they don't use the mandrels at all.  (personally I find that fascinating to watch...)

When making a glass item on the rod, the rod is there to be used as a tool.  So after the item is made you want to take the mandrel away.  Glass applied directly to the metal will stick (weld for ever more) to the rod.  So a very think watery clay some times called slip or kiln wash, but referred to here as bead release (I think it has a slightly different composition, but essentially the same thing) is put on the mandrel to create a physical barrier between the glass and the mandrel.  This means that the mandrels can be used over and over.  Some times the bead release cracks and the bead gets stuck to the mandrel any way and then the fun begins!!

rods that and not coated and have no flux

I am guessing at this point but it is my understanding that at the high temperatures the flux and the bead release mix.  And this stops the bead release from acting as a barrier and actually helps the glass to stick to the rod.  I imagine it smells pretty bad too!

I only sell 316L Stainless

As you can see from the above this is the exact stuff that we need.  Traditionally we have used diameters of

1.6
2.4
3
4
5
6

(There may be others I have completely missed   )  I personally like the 1.6 and 2.4.  I have a few of the thicker ones but, for me, the thicker the rod, the harder the glass is to control.

I guess, as a individuals, making your own mandrels is something that we only need to do every couple of years.  Because of the quantities or rods that we need to by (bundles of 100 making for me 300 rods though could easily be 400) and that hopefully we don't loose to many maybe when we are more experienced one or two a week replenishing is something that we don't need to do very often.  Mind you I am still at hobby stage, many of the others do this as a business so they may feel differently.

Maybe smaller bundles if this was possible?

Because this is a very expensive hobby/business we do tend to bargain hunt.  And considering the amount of time and work that goes in to our miniature pieces of art the financial rewards aren't really that 'rewarding'.  There may sometimes be only a pounds difference between one item or another we will got got the cheaper (assuming that it's of the same quality)

I hope I have answered your questions (and made sense).  If you have more please feel free to ask.  I am sure that if I have got anything drastically wrong the others will point it out  If you want to have a go there is a big event in April where there will be loads of torches set up and other people doing demos.  ( come join us on the dark side... )  also go to You Tube and do a search on Lampworking and you can see it in action

[Mary]

Just to add to the other comments, it's really the 316L we want, because it doesn't bend too easily and it doesn't rust.

And some of us like them shorter, about 9 inches to fit right in the kiln, but others like longer ones, 12 inches.

ETA the sizes we'll likely buy most of are 1.6 and 2.4.

[Funky Cow]

I'll echo the nice smooth ends request. I'm using cut welding rods and they're great ~ except cutting the buggers up and filing the ends was a complete pain in the 'arris 

[glassworks]

i run ours over a belt sander to clean up the edges, but thats cause we use a cut saw - i suspect the purpose made steel cutting disk will be way smoother?..

[Fin]

Hi all, Thanks for the replys. Sounds like a great hobby/business to do... Beats welding under cars Im sure (Its been a long day today...... )

OK, I will look into what we can do in the 316L. As you know the TIG rods have stamped ends stating the grade of 316L. You only get this on industry standard Welding rods that are of a high quality.

"Cheap" rods can be found that do not have the stamped ends, But its a lucky dip to the actual grade of Stainless they are made of.

So a mixed pack would be good?

I'll have a look into what I can make available

Back in the near future

Cheers
Fin

[helbels]

One other thing... The rods have to be nice and straight, because if they are kinked or wonky it's hard to make a good round bead.

The bit you can really help with Fin is selling these rods in packs that are already cut to 10inch lengths, and in the sizes already specified.

People have been buying the long rods from you and then cutting them to the lengths we need themselves, but it's hard work and rather tiring, so anything you can do to simplify this for people will probably attract custom!

Hope that helps!

[Pat from Canvey]

I use diapads to smooth the ends. Takes a few seconds.

[Fin]

Hi All,
OK

Ive made the packs smaller.

Ive incresed what we stock to include 1.6mm , 2.4mm & 3.2mm

Ive also listed a selection pack that includes  15 x of each of the sizes

Keeping them straight.... We have new packaging tubes which will protect against the postal system



OK the length issue. Its 1m lengths for now Im affraid. I will address this in the new year as we are reducing the ammount of fabrication work we do then to consentrate on our componet sales. This will give  the time to offer extra services such as cutting.

As you know our Rods are listed on Ebay (along with others)

Cheers
Fin
Dynoflow UK

[Zeldazog]

Fin, a direct link to your shop would be useful.... 

Either put it in a post here, or add it to your signature, so it always appears.

[Fin]

http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/Dynoflow-Stainless-Exhausts


Here you go, See the section for TIG RODS

[Linz]

Thanks Fin, that's brilliant