Lost in post - Claiming from Royal Mail

ejralph · September 16, 2008, 06:19:25 PM

It really does seem suspciously high to me.

I think if it were me, I would go in large and tell Royal Mail I am calling in the police if they do not launch a full investigation. Sounds ludicrous, but we did this my old business. We had one whole sack of mail go missing - all computer software. SO obviously it was stolen by royal mail staff.

They really couldn't care less and just told us to fill out forms for each and every package. When we told them we considered that not good enough, that we suspected theft had occured whilst the items were in their charge and we intended to report it to the police - well suddenly things started to get looked into properly. They found the toerag in the end and gave him the boot I think.

I bet that someone either at the local post office or the local sorting office recognises the packages and is helping themselves to a couple each week.

I am sure that postwatch probably have the official figures of lost mail that you could quote at RM, but whatever those exact figures are I am sure they are a heck of a lot lower than the losses you are experiencing. Hope you get it sorted out. You shouldn't have to bear the burden of that.

Emma

Mary · September 16, 2008, 10:38:42 PM

My Mum's PO or sorting office has a bad apple too, greetings cards (that might have a fiver tucked in) regularly fail to turn up. Annoyingly ours still go awol even though there's never cash in them. It's not a nice situation for you Sooz, frustrating.

Soozintheshed · September 26, 2008, 09:38:55 PM

Quote from: ejralph on September 15, 2008, 10:03:55 PM
Sooz, that is a hell of a lot of missing packages.

Yup, they are supposidly investigating it, but are they? Nothing seems to change. We took our logo off our packages and it made a slight difference.

It HAS to be someone in Carlisle, as a test I sent a swarovski pendant to my sister two streets from the Post Office we drop the parcels off at, it never arrived. They would rather just give us a quid to keep up quiet than try and find out what going wrong !

Of course, your customers blame you, neg feedbacks and stuff, such is life.

We have it pinned down to large letters, 46p postage (franked) on certain days of the week.

And still it goes on......

Dragonfire Glass · September 26, 2008, 10:09:13 PM

So send a similar package or three wth a note in it saying 'we're on to you, this package has been specially treated with an invisible indelible dye''

Soozintheshed · September 27, 2008, 09:30:22 AM

Brilliant idea !

Mary · September 27, 2008, 11:25:48 AM

I think that is so awful Sooz, you must feel helpless.

sea-thistle · September 27, 2008, 03:00:40 PM

Hi , I think I know a little about Post Office Counters/ Royal Mail as I worked for them for altogether about 18 years. I worked in Customer Care! gulp and The Business Unit, a few of the Depts I worked in including Counters for 12 years. I understand your frustration with them!! There is nothing worse than and ex employee moaning about the service to them. A few points Recorded Delivery, does not cover valuables, jewellery etc and I think Royal Mail will try and include loose beads as that as well!! also glass articles. Recorded Delivery items just go in with the rest of the mail, it does not get any special treatment, and you are really relying on the postman to get a signature for the item when it is delivered! I have received recordeds that I have not signed for and alarmingly Registered from overseas which says to be signed for in English! Also if you go onto Royal Mail track service to see if your Recorded has been delivered, I have found I can never track it! or get a copy showing the signature, even though it's been delivered! It is really bad! As for so many items going missing every month. The IB section, Investigation Branch, Policing Section of the Post Office should be looking into that one. You should take it further and complain to the Delivery Office Manager, and if no luck the Postmaster.I think trying to remember a legal body you can report about your mail service. The Post Office Users Council, I think! I must admit if I send anything of value over £20 I send it RMSD, on the whole I have found people are prepared to pay the extra to make sure that there purchases get there.It a sad fact that their are dishonest people everywhere who given the opportunity will steal. When I joined Royal Mail, the staff were usually ex-forces or had family working in Royal Mail. Please do not give up, you have to work at them!! If you make enough noise about it, something will be done!!

Dragonfire Glass · October 03, 2008, 08:12:20 PM

A package to Germany has gone astray

I have to wait 25 DAYS before I can claim!
What do I do?
Refund or ask her to wait - I thought it was 15

ejralph · October 03, 2008, 08:31:57 PM

Eek

That's a tricky one. All my experience thus far has been for inland missing items only. I rather suspect RM will try to wiggle out of overseas items. But, still claim and still go in hard on them is my best advice. I really think if they feel the person they are dealing with is not likely to just sit back and take no for an answer, they are more likely to take the claim seriously.

In regards to refunding really it depends on your terms of business although legally I think you will be bound by the distance selling regs as much as you would be for a UK customer. So as per DSR you need to supply the goods within 30 days unless you have agreed a different period with your customer.

So you could be within your rights to ask your customer to bear with you and await 30 days. That gives the package time to show up and allows you to put in a claim too. But you cannot make your refund dependant on getting your money back from RM. Really that is your loss and from a legal point of view you need to refund your customer. It is better also to work it out amicably with them rather than risk them doing a chargeback through Paypal needlessly.

You can find info on distance selling regs here, if you want to research it all further http://www.oft.gov.uk/advice_and_resources/small_businesses/distance-selling/

Emma

Dragonfire Glass · October 03, 2008, 08:34:38 PM

Thanks Emma

I think I will refund her anyway and fight it out with Royal Mail.
This is the first I have ever had go missing so I can't complain too much

Soozintheshed · October 05, 2008, 09:01:12 PM

I have just had a package to the USA go missing, 6 Beading mags to the total of nearly £20 but was "international signed for " too, you got to wonder where they might be $:-\$

ejralph · October 06, 2008, 09:39:45 AM

Blinking eck Sooz.

I would try sending from a different PO if I were you.

I hope you get somewhere claiming. Really think you should try to push them to do an investigation too. I know it is hard to find the time for these sorts of wild goose chases when you are in business, but I really do feel someone is on the make somewhere at your expense and this is way above acceptable losses. You shouldn't have to be carrying the burden for all this thievery - which is undoubtedly what it is.

Emma

Soozintheshed · October 06, 2008, 01:59:16 PM

This is the first one that has gone astray which is bigger than pocket size, so maybe this one genuinely is lost in post

I have to wonder though, I get a few things sent to me, which I am supposed to sign for but never do, I wonder if other people see it as a way of getting a refund if they have not signed. Maybe I am just being sceptical

ejralph · October 06, 2008, 04:21:40 PM

Quote from: Soozintheshed on October 06, 2008, 01:59:16 PM
This is the first one that has gone astray which is bigger than pocket size, so maybe this one genuinely is lost in post

I have to wonder though, I get a few things sent to me, which I am supposed to sign for but never do, I wonder if other people see it as a way of getting a refund if they have not signed. Maybe I am just being sceptical

This is so true in general terms.

I think that was something we were discussing up-thread wasn't it? How pointless the Recorded Delivery service is and how it can cause more problems than it is worth. Other than covering your butt from a Seller Protection point of view with Paypal, it has precious little going for it really.

I hesitate to tempt fate, because there are obviously bad apples in every community and people who will take advantage of you - but really I do think beady people are very, very honest though.

My customers have at times come close to moving me to tears with their support, loyalty and honesty. No joke. Beady people really do rock. When I think back to the patience and loyalty they showed me a year ago when Royal Mail were on strike and secretly warehousing our post on random days. Well, I still get a lump in my throat thinking about how kind and gracious everyone was waiting for their packages. If they hadn't, I would have been even more stressed out and helpless than I was already. And so, that sort of trust cuts both ways I think. We simply cannot allow the few bad eggs to make us treat everyone else with too deep a suspicion.

On the whole, most people are good and honest and very, very supportive of small businesses. They often know the pressures we are under and how even little losses can have a big impact on the bottom line. So when it comes to a toss up about who I would suspect - a customer, or the royal mail staff, I know which one my money would go on usually! (Although my local post office are superb also. A genuine good village post office and I am sure they are part of the reason I have so few packages go astray. I even get free war stories from Roy "I'm 82 you know". Who incidently is more on the ball than the rest of them put together, especially when it comes to understanding the bizarre computer system of the Royal Mail Mothership)

Like most crimes though, it so often is the one or two individuals causing most of the problems. There is probably one postie somewhere along the line pocketting all these packages. If only that one could be found out and taken out of the equation, I expect your loss rate would suddenly change right back to where it should be.

As for the magazines - I guess much depends on where they went to. An international signed for sticker probably made them seem more interesting than just beady magazines. That is the most annoying thing. But chances are they are stuck in customs somewhere and will take a while longer to arrive or just make their way home to you when they get hungry....

I once took a package to be shipped to one of the South American countries, and Jill the postmistress said to me "oh, It will be interesting to see if this arrives there - are you not worried about sending stuff to South America then?"

"Well I am NOW!" says I with the blood draining from my face.

No indication to say it didn't get there though, so I guess all was well!

Emma

Bumpy Beads · October 06, 2008, 04:40:37 PM

Royal Mail are a royal pain. Twice in the last week I've arrived home from work to find packages on my doorstep. One was a recorded delivery item, and the other was a special delivery package from Palmers containing almost £200 of silver wire. A few months ago my postman folded an envelope of wire in half to fit it through the letterbox, ruining it in the process. What planet are they on? My usual postman is brillliant but whenever we have a stand-in it all goes belly up. I complain to RM every time they do something stupid, but it doesn't seem to make any difference at all.