Torch angle, flame visibility????

[CrystalArt]

I'm hoping someone can shed some light on this!

I've got my HH (set up with bulk propane), and have been using it for the last few weeks - but I cannot find the right angle for the torch, where I can see how close I am working to the flame.

If I angle it further upwards, then I misjudge and constantly find myself working under or through the flame, and having to move my hands upwards. If I position the torch at a lower angle, then with the foreshortening effect (i.e. looking along it more) I can't judge where the hot part etc of the flame is.

I've got a black painted heat proof surface under it (trying to get some sort of black worktop to use instead) - and theoretically can see the flame against it. But with didymium specs on, I'm having constant trouble seeing where to work in the flame, or indeed where the end of the flame is.   

It's really stressful on my eyes - I'm working in the "conservatory" - i.e. windows all round, translucent roof - and think too much ambient light is one problem, but then working at night, when I can control my light source, is only marginally better.  It seems to be an issue with the HH on bulk propane - the flame is so, well, blue - I don't remember having this issue with the MAPP bottles, and certainly not on the one day lesson I had a couple of years ago on a dual fuel.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.  I simply can't see what I'm doing half the time - for instance trying to apply stringers is next to impossible if you can't judge where to hold the dang thing in the flame!  I'm at my wits' ends - does anyone else have this problem or even remotely know what I mean?   

Really, REALLY looking forward to hearing from someone on this!

Sally (S, in Suffolk)

[helbels]

Well I'm not going to be much help here... but I do work on a Hothead.  I haven't really had the problems you are facing.  I work in my bedroom, so not much light coming in, but I can clearly see where the end of the blue cone ends and disappears to nothing.  I think it's trial and error to get a feel for where in the flame you are working - perhaps you just need to spend some time putting glass rods in the flame and moving them around, to try to get a "feel" for the sweet spot.  I do have perspex sides on my work area, so if I look in those, I can see the flame reflected, and where my rod is in the flame, which helps sometimes.    I also work with my hothead head parallel to the bench, rather than pointing in the air as the kit would suggest to do.  Much easier I find.  Not sure if any of that has been any help.  If not, I'm sure someone else will be along in a minute.

[SilverGems89]

Sally, i have the same problem, and i work in a normal room with only one window so i can imagine how much harder it is in a conservatory! the only thing i can say is i learnt a lot about where the different parts of the flame are once i started trying to use stringer
Sorry i dont have any more helpful suggestions!

[Beachside]

I have exactly the same problem too and really need to have a go at adjusting things to see if i can make it any better. With my diddy's on I can't see a flame at all so don't have a clue whether i'm even in the flame or not half the time, then I end up looking over them to see where I am and usually result in losing patience and chucking them down in a huff lol.
I have a window in front of me so i'm thinking that was bad planning on my part and I have my HH fairly upright.

Tanya x

[sarah t]

not on hot head but did set up my torch near a window for the ventilation and fan etc and did have a problem with light from the widow and flame visability......  so put paper over the glass behind torch and this seamed to make enough difference so i could see the flame and what i was doing a lot better ......not made much difference to my stinger control though  

re position of torch i think you just have to find what works for you ...which is not much help i know ..but i sit stand do the hookey cookey ...what ever works !!

[Snips]

Hi, I work in the kitchen, and if I try during the day, I can't see anything other than sparkly dust in the light coming through the windows, so evenings, or dull days only for me.  Without the sunshine I can see fairly well where the hot spot is (i.e. where the really blue bit dissapears), but it is guesswork on stringers, as I constantly think I need to work in the flame that I can see, whereas I get better results if I add a couple of inches to where I think I should be - i.e. where I cannot see any flame, but where there is still heat. 

Angle wise, I work with my HH at about 45%, which was the best angle for me, but I think this is just trial and error.

Good luck finding the best solution.   

[CrystalArt]

SilverGems and Tanya, SarahT and Jackie - thank you so much for letting me know I'm not alone!  Blocking some of the light obviously helps.  I just need to keep experimenting, till I find something I can work with.

Also the angle of the torch does seem to differ a great deal from person to person, and maybe I should try a day or so with each angle - certainly haven't tried it parallel to the table, so will do that for starters, and keep angling it up bit by bit, if that doesn't work.  I really do need to get the torch position sorted before I try to mount it more permanently than the current clamp and L bracket!

And Helbels - your perspex sides sound promising, think I'll try that.  So, blocking more light, perspex sides, and continued experimenting with torch position - a three pronged attack - that really should help.

Such a great relief that I'm not alone - that others here know exactly what I mean.  Thank you so very, very much for your prompt responses!!  - 

Sally x (S, in Suffolk)

[Kalorlo]

Yeah, the place I work in the flame is an inch or two above the cone that I can see. With rods this is usually ok - I'm used to where it is - but with stringers I have to move things around until something starts happening... sometimes running away from me! I have real problems when it's sunny (window to my left) because I can't see whether things are glowing unless they're really glowing. I've just rigged up a piece of paper to the side of my barley box (well away from the flame!) that blocks direct sunlight slanting onto my torch, so hopefully that won't be a problem anymore.

My HH is fairly upright.

[Hazer]

I think it's time for me to admit I've never seen my hothead flame. Not once. I work by sound and feel 

[Redkite]

I used to have the same problem, working in a conservatory. I didn't realise the issue for months, as I always worked at night, but the first time I tried in daylight was a nightmare!!!

I agree that when you get more experienced, you can "sense" where the flame is and perhaps don't need as many visual clues, but I found depth perception in particular was really difficult.

I would recommend either blinds, working at night or finding somewhere that's not quite as bright to work. I am now in a shed with blackout blinds and find it much easier to wrk with a lowish light level

[Stacy]

I've not had this issue as my work areas have been quite dark but I have heard about people using strategically placed mirrors when having a problem finding the right place in the flame.

[Mary]

Another tip to try is to angle your torch a little to one side, not straight away from you. Mine points slightly to the right because that suits how I hold my mandrel. You can see more of the flame and the torch itself isn't so much in your line of vision.

[Dragonfire Glass]

I also work in a conservatory but on a minor.
I have a white blind in front of me over that window but do find it much easier to torch with a bit of cloud in the sky. I love working on rainy days 

[Carol]

I'm in a porch with windows along one side, I have a wooden board over the one in front of where my torch is, but if I'm in there & the sun has moved around a bit I pin my leather apron up at the window. Primitive but it works 

[stuwaudby]

I place a tile of slate under my workspace, it acts as a grey neutral background and is safe to put hot rod ends onto.

I find working at night much easier. Clear and white glass is a particular problem during the day because it melts before it starts emitting radiant light. Stick to colours during the day till you get more experienced.