I have got the money together (thanks to my mum) to be able to buy a kiln and I am having such a hard time trying to decide which one!! I like the door on the bead cube and the fact that it is small so I wouldn't have to relocate all of my jewellery making bits however I like the extra size of the SC2 and have heard good things about it.
Then my husband saw that there wasn't much price difference between that and the bluebird which would be far to big for me now but I would probably never outgrow it. It would mean moving all of my jewellery making bits though which wouldn't be a massive issue but maybe a little headache.
How on earth do you decide - Help please!!!
It depends what you want to do with it . I recently bought an SC2 with bead door and window as I wanted to garage beads and also fire metal clay in a firing box so needed the versatility.
I did look at the Beadcube, but thought I wouldn't fit as much in, and the Bluebird didn't get hot enough for metal clay.
Jane
The main decision is 'what do I want to do?' If you only want to do beads and have no interest in fusing,metal clay etc then a Paragon Bluebird is ideal. It does however only anneal beads but it has lots of space for lots and lots of beads!!
For anything else you need a kiln that fires at higher temps, say an sc2 or sc3(slightly bigger than the sc2 version) Both these kilns are produced in the USA and then imported to us.
Your other choice is a company called Kilncare. They produce similar kilns but they are built right here in the UK.
I know lots of bead makers choose kilncare and lots choose Paragons. The important thing is to get the kiln that suites your needs.
I hope this helps :)
Em xx
Well done on getting the money - I bet your a happy bunny ;D
I think the 'what do I want to do' is exactly the right question to be asking yourself - and maybe think about 'what would I like to do, or have a go at in the future'.
For me this would be an easy question to answer as in the future I want to incorporate ceramics into the equation, so my next kiln will be a good size ceramic kiln, as I know they are more versatile, as my mother was a potter for over 30 years and made some amazing things using different mediums.
I have outgrown my little kiln which is the same size as a bead cube maybe a bit bigger, and know that a glass kiln I personally would find too restrictive - only my opinion of course :)
If you haven't already, have a look here: www.paragonkilns.co.uk/shop.htm?https://cherryheavensafeshopping.portal.ID0625
Good luck on choosing, and let us know what you decide.
Take your time thinking about this, as I agree with everyone about trying to future-proof your decision! The Beadcube, SC2 and Maxine are all excellent kilns for beads. I chose the SC2 as I wanted to work with silverclay and Bronzeclay, but now space is at a premium in my little studio, so I am downsizing to the cube. I think that I am an exception to the rule though!
If you do decide on the SC2, Tuffnells sell a fab little bead rack to cram as many beads in as you can, and Kilncare do the same for the cube.
My first kiln was a hobby fuser, which I love. Had a paragon sc3, no bead door, wasn't keen on it and sold it on. Then I bought a maxine just for beads, so that I could fuse and bead on the same day. It's a shame that the maxine temp doesn't go a bit higher though for small scale fusing. Janet I would also like a vitrograph kiln and a kiln that can cope with porcelain, sadly I will not get either of these. Janet
Thanks a lot everyone, I think I am leaning towards the SC2 as although I don't do anything else now I am sure it will only be a matter of time before I might like a go at fusing or metal clay so this would at least give me those options if I wanted to.
Next question is do I need the window? The bead door is a must for me but as the kiln will be raised slightly do I need the window or is this a good thing to have for say fusing?
It is all so confusing but in a good way.
Thanks again x
Theres one for sale on here -sounds a bargain: http://www.frit-happens.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=41185.0;topicseen
Inc P & P :o not sure if its got a bead door
You'd definitely need a bead door if you are going to anneal as you go - unless you only wanted to batch anneal! I'm not sure how much visibility you'd get with the window, but I'm sure someone here will know!
£450 is an excellent price. Last week there was one sold on ebay and that was the basic one without the bead door for £509.93 - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/200923803478?ru=http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_nkw=200923803478&_rdc=1
Edited to add - but a new one with kiln shelf is £579 including delivery...
But is nice to know quite how much they hold their value...
Mine doesn't have a bead door, which I thought at the start was a pain - but now I prefer to plan my work - make a few beads etc and then batch anneal. for me personally I can see which things I want to recreate and it has saved me time and has reduced wasted glass.
I think we're making it harder for decisions!
Are you thinking that making lots of sets will be in your future plans? And do you prefer making quick beads as opposed to labouring over 1 for ages? Also, how much time in one sitting do you have to make beads? If you have full days to bead in and will probably make loads then a Maxine might well be the way forward.
The sc2 for sale is mine, it does have a bead door xx
Quote from: binty on May 21, 2013, 02:06:26 PM
The sc2 for sale is mine, it does have a bead door xx
I'm really tempted - might be nice to have another kiln with a bead door, then I can batch & bead anneal as I go :D
There are advantages to annealing as you go; some striking colours can behave very differently, and shocky colours (like some of the opalinos and messy ones) have a far better survival rate!
Hubby says no - not allowed to buy it - must stick to buying a large ceramic kiln.
If you've not got a bead door you can chop mandrels down to fit in kiln, hold them in a pinvice whilst forming bead. Release and chuck them in. A pair of long handled barbecue tongs can then be used to shuffle them around.
I don't think anyone has chipped in for the beadcube yet - and I have to say for a first kiln, it really can't be beaten. That's why you almost never see them come up for sale - not least because if you decide to upgrade to a maxi/ne you can keep the same controller, which saves quite a big on the cost of the new one. If you did want to sell it on, they keep their value amazingly well.
I can do bits of mini fusing in mine, as well as fire metal clay on the extremely rare occasions I feel so inclined and have never had a problem with running out of space in a session. I've been totally delighted with it from day one. I'd add that I previously had an SC2 and chose to replace it with the cube simply for the tiny footprint, separate controller and portability.
I'd also say that the service from Kilncare is second to none. Lee is one of the nicest, most helpful blokes you could ever wish to deal with, and the aftersales service is just fantastic.
Quote from: mizgeorge on May 21, 2013, 04:56:41 PM
I'd also say that the service from Kilncare is second to none. Lee is one of the nicest, most helpful blokes you could ever wish to deal with, and the aftersales service is just fantastic.
I second that - Lee is a really nice bloke and the rest of the guy's! The bead cube looks a lovely kiln :)
Quote from: ARBeads on May 21, 2013, 04:47:16 PM
If you've not got a bead door you can chop mandrels down to fit in kiln, hold them in a pinvice whilst forming bead. Release and chuck them in. A pair of long handled barbecue tongs can then be used to shuffle them around.
That is very innovative idea - me learning lots - thanks Nicknaks Designs for starting this thread ;)
I love my beadcube too - and I'll say that if space is an issue for you then it really can't be beaten - you can even pop it away in a cupboard once you're done.
I've only filled it twice in the three years or so I've had it - its much more capacious than you'd think, unless you specialise in large focals.
Its next to impossible to find 1 kiln which does everything well, its always a compromise. I would buy the biggest I can afford. I agree with the others the service at Kilncare is outstanding, I have a maxine for bead making and love it to bits but other kilns to do other jobs.
Quote from: JKC on May 21, 2013, 12:16:28 PM
Janet I would also like a vitrograph kiln and a kiln that can cope with porcelain, sadly I will not get either of these. Janet
The Caldera goes t0 about 1290 Centrigrade I believe, and can be used as a vitrigraph kiln too as the base can be removed I think.
Quote from: Glyn Burton on May 21, 2013, 06:55:21 PM
I would buy the biggest I can afford.
I have to say I do agree with that!
I'd also say consider a bead cube.
As George says, they never come up for sale, which means people keep hold of them!
Whilst it's okay trying to future proof your purchase, you will NEVER get one kiln that does it all (well, I guess that's not strictly true, the Bead Cube, the SC2 and others do cover bead annealing, enameling, silver clay, fusing... but only small, so still don't really cover all bases)
Someone might say they want to buy something bigger on the basis that they might want to fuse a big plate sometime in the future, but have they tried fusing and do they like it/get on with it and how often will they actually be using the full footprint? If you're fairly near the start of your bead making journey, you will have plenty of experimenting to do to keep you occupied for quite a while yet! Besides, you can always hire kiln space if needed.Likewise, someone might consider a Maxine because they want to make loads of beads, but when will that day come that it's needed? Do you need to buy a mahoosive kiln but that can't do anything other than anneal beads?
As Emma says, you have to make your decision based on what you're mainly going to use it for, otherwise, you will be going round in circles for ever more.
Even though I absolutely love my Hobbyfuser, I would still like A) a Bead Cube for samples, enameling, bead annealing. B) a specific ceramics kiln for, well, ceramics, and they're good for cast pieces as they're usually deeper. Then of course, C) a big, human sized flat bed glass kiln for when I want to do several large plates or one giant piece... oh, and I always D) fancied the Paragon Home Artist so I have a mobile kiln for classes.... and a E) Caldera or similar to have a go a vitrigraph....
Maybe I should just go and live in in the Kiln Care factory ;D ;D
Quote from: Glyn Burton on May 21, 2013, 06:55:21 PM
I would buy the biggest I can afford.
Orrrrrr by the smallest and cheapest you can get away with because one is never enough!
I went for the biggest I could afford - I think Glynn twisted my arm - and he's right...now I want to fuse something the size of a door and can't...not that I could afford a kiln for that!! But, I did struggle with the argument that if I had a small one and then went for bigger I might be able to keep both!
It's a traumatic decision, but you probably have one your belly is telling you to buy - I went with that in the end :) Then I had to get him indoors to re-arrange the garage and now I need a studio!
You won't go wrong with what's recommended here, but there will be compromise if you want something to do more than one thing. You won't lose an awful lot of money if you want to sell it and try another, they hold their value amazingly well if you take care of them.
I realise that I have waffled on and not helped! I'll get my coat.
I bought a SC2 about 8 months ago and have grown out of it. It will be fine if you are just looking at annealing your beads and making small jewellery bits but if you decide to go into making larger items I can get a coaster into it but only one at a time and the biggest bowl/plate I can get in their is 16cm. I'm now having to make the decision whether to go for something bigger or stick with what I have!!!!!
Dunno if I'm much help having just bought my 4th kiln.... ::)
But I also have a Beadcube and although I don't make beads that often, I have done everything else in this little kiln. From fusing, slumping, casting to silverclay. The only downside is it doesn't go hot enough for ceramics.
I have an SC2 as I wanted the capability for fusing, should I want to try that. I also batch anneal and would not need a maxine as I never make nearly enough beads in one go for one of those. So a couple of months ago I decided to give fusing a go and agree that an SC2 is fine for small bits, but I quickly realised I wanted something a bit bigger. I have now been lucky enough to get a Skutt Firebox 14 second hand and am in the process of doing some test pieces to get used to it, but so far it's great :) However, I won't be getting rid of the SC2 as I will still use this for beads. So, as has been said, you need to consider what you want and go from there :)
I've got an SC2 with a bead door. I use it for garaging beads and fusing. I started my love affair with glass with a microwave kiln, and still use it for some small things, like earrings, but use the SC2 more. I've recently started making some coaster/trivet type thingies, and find that if I put one in the corner of the shelf I can get several pendants/earrings around it, so kill two birds with one stone (or something like that). I dare say that one day I may want to fuse something bigger, and hope to have enough money to buy a bigger kiln then, but for now the SC2 does me just right!
Nick
I have ordered the Bead Cube :)
I decided that as they both do the same things and that space is an issue and I do like the bigger door on the Cube to go for that one. So excited now
Thank you so much for all the replies and really pleased this thread has been useful for others x
Personally I think you have made a wise decision...but then again I would wouldn't I ;D
lol thanks Lee, it is on it's second batch anneal to get all my beads done and I love it. It is easy to use, small enough to fit in my very limited space in my 4x6 shed and big enough to hold all the beads I can manage to make in a sitting. Thanks for a brilliant kiln.
I use a beadcube too, it is a perfect size for me and so far has worked perfectly with no problems.
Jill :)
I loved my bead cube and kinda wish I had kept it, but upgraded to the Maxi as I was making big beads and beading all day and I love my Maxi too! :) Hope you enjoy your cube it is a fabulous kiln and I can't say enough about Lee and Kilncare (you can pay me later Lee ;) ). :) :)
Come on Nikki lets see those beads ;)