Pricing can be a difficult issue, both in terms of working out what to charge and charging what your work is really worth. Everybodies perceptions are different on these topics, there is no right or wrong, but this is the place to talk about it.
Please remember your words can be read by many so post accordingly.
Who would like to kick us off with a good pricing formula?
I would like to remind old and tell new members of Emma Ralph's article on pricing - it's on her webbie, and contains a lot of useful info: http://www.ejrbeads.co.uk/pricingjewellery.htm
That's an excellent article :)
Quote from: Sulis on May 25, 2010, 07:23:27 PM
That's an excellent article :)
And one I've referred to many a time ;D
I was going to post that too but Julie beat me to it ;D
I have relied on Emma's price advice through thick and thin - it's not easy, but it works!
I don't really have a rigid formula but it is along the lines of: add up cost of materials, charge for time (designing + making) at an appropriate hourly rate (mine's based on the rate I get in my other freelance job), add on a proportion of overheads (heating, lighting, insurance, etc.). That gives the barest minimum that I am prepared to get out of bed for, i.e. a wholesale price. I roughly double it for retail and add on a percentage to cover Etsy and Paypay fees. Then I get out there and promote the heck out of whatever-it-is, so that six months down the line when nobody has bought it, at least I can be fairly certain it isn't because they didn't know I had it for sale :P
You seem to have sussed it, Lynn! I am so impressed!! :)
My pricing formula for hobby artists goes like this: "If this was my full time job, the one that's supposed to pay my bills and put food on my table, how much would I have to charge for making another one of these?" Remember to take into account that a huge portion of the price goes away in taxes etc. If you're a hobby artist and don't have to pay taxes, then good for you - you made a bit extra. (I don't know how it works for you people, but here in Sweden you don't have to pay taxes for your hobby income if the hobby doesn't give revenue, so as long as you buy more glass than you sell beads you're fine.)
Those who actually do this as their full time job that pays the bills and puts the food on the table hopefully already have it figured out, or they'll soon find they're not eating or paying bills ;D
Quote from: julieHB on May 25, 2010, 09:56:17 PM
You seem to have sussed it, Lynn! I am so impressed!! :)
I wouldn't exactly call it 'sussed', but I do a good line in convincing BS, don't I? ;D :P
Seriously though, it's taken me four years to get anywhere close to (a) getting my head round how retail vs. wholesale pricing is supposed to work and (b) having the brass neck to value my time at something like a commercial rate and then hold my head up when people tell me I'm too expensive. (And while I am being polite to these people - darned British reserve, it really is a handicap - I am really longing to say: OF COURSE I'm expensive, dammit, there's only one of me, I make one-off originals and I make 'em as well as I possibly can, and I've got thirty(ahem)something years' experience and a shed load of publications to my name... if you want mass produced cheap tat you can f*** off back to the high street >:()
If what I make isn't selling at what I reckon is a fair price, I'd rather go away and make something different than slash my prices. That has the additional benefit that it stops me from getting bored as well as keeping me a step ahead of anybody who might be thinking of copying me 8)
Lynn I have very much the same way of working as you. It's worked for years and if it isn't broke I'm not going to try and fix it.
I was once told to work out your hourly rate you should figure out what you want/need as a yearly income. Then work out how many hours you can work in a week and multiply that by 52. Take your yearly wage and divide it by the number of hours you work in the year to get an hourly figure.
Works out that to earn £25,000 per annum working 40 hour weeks you should be charging yourself out at £12 per hour.
25000/(40*52) = 12.01923076923077
When I did my hourly rate I looked at the rate of pay for other skilled jobs since you don't really want to go over the general going rate. Though it seems anywhere between £8 and £12/hour is normal.
I've also heard people say they add in an average of that hourly rate to all pieces to cover promotion, driving to and from the post office/supplier, sourcing materials etc. Technically we probably should but it all seems a little over the top especially when if you know how most promotion can be done automatically through social media and RSS feeds. Another one is craft fairs, I can spend anywhere from 5 to 16 hours a week standing shows but do you factor in a second hourly rate as a retailer as well as your time making the items.
I suppose the other side of the coin is do you charge a whole figure or go for the 99p theory. Some think it cheapens your craftsmanship others will stand by the fact that it is a sure way to make people think they are spending less and are more inclined to buy.
Quote"OF COURSE I'm expensive, dammit, there's only one of me, I make one-off originals and I make 'em as well as I possibly can, and I've got thirty(ahem)something years' experience and a shed load of publications to my name... if you want mass produced cheap tat you can f*** off back to the high street."
I like that quote. Maybe we need a sign of it, similar to those you don't have to be crazy to work here ones.
Scarlet xx
My brother in law had been here and been really helpful with my setting up my website and I was showing him what I would be selling, (he's great and very honest but said I wasn't charging enough. Anyway, I have priced according to what I thinks ok and on a similar level to other jewellery sellers using same kind of materials quality etc....so last night my bils ex (still friendlyish) said they would love to see what I was making so I pointed her to my sites etsy website flickr . She wrote back, stunning but way out of my price rnge. Made me just doubt myself a bit on the one hand but on the other I am going to answer her and say well talk to your ex he said my prices are still too low.
But at my local craft fair I was next to a regular (by mistake by her doing a swop) with regular customers and much lower prices very different jewellery little swarovski earrings all prettily boxed etc, and I thought I wouldnt sell anything but in fact did really well, many people bought from her but many people bought from me too and didnt think the prices were too high.
Frankly just now I am at a loss as to what to do, craft fairs and exhibitions and the stuff I have in a boutique do really well, online is nada. I am revamping the website ( well other half is) and changing the stuff around and adding new bits but all my fairs are at the end of the year as they seem to be my best place and time to sell and that means very littl coming in each month. My lampworking is doing well though and I will be adding my own beads to my stuff which feels great. I am well confused over this at the moment and having a bit of a crisis of confidence.
Sorry for going on, and if I have gone of topic and rambled, just that I woke up this morning feeling a bit despondent.
There is a world of difference between what an item is worth and what an individual can afford to pay. When someone comments that something is expensive, I take it to mean that they can't afford it (which is a shame, but a fact of life), rather than that I am overcharging for the item. We can all look at what others are charging and what the "going rate" for things is and assess our work against others' offers. It's human nature to say something is expensive when what we mean is either we couldn't or wouldn't pay the price asked for it.
Kazx
Oh, and for what it's worth Jean, my own view of your website is that it looks lovely, well presented, nice jewellery - but I think some of the pieces have been in there for a while so if you have other stock you have been selling at fairs, it's probably worth a bit of a swap round to refresh it?
Kazx
Thanks for that Kaz, you are right about the website, and the etsy shop to come to that, I am in the process of changing everything round and taking new photos and putting them up and taking the website stuff to fairs. Think I have got a bit 'stuck' if you know what I mean. :)
Yes expensive doesnt always mean overcharging thats true.
It also is useful if you work out how much your studio costs to run per minute, so if you've fiddled about for 10 minutes with a snowflake it's quick to figure how much it should cost.(remember, there is also a cost to time spent accounting ;-) )
Don't forget to add the cost for your kit too, because eventually your torch will wear out, your oxycon will keel over, the kiln will strike, tools will break etc. Figure out how long something should last (say a kiln should be ok for 10 years), then divide that appropriately to add to the cost per minute of studio time. (or a cost per day).
Also, count objects you break, if you spent 20 minutes on a bead and it goes *boom* on the mandrel or later in the kiln or the package, that is all part of the cost of running your business.
Keep a spreadsheet/log and update it every day, put in what you sold/made/broke, and how long you worked that day on what tasks. I know that sounds a bit OCD, but it'll help you see patterns in your work flow.
Lastly, a lot of councils run small business courses for free, check it out, they can be a lot of fun to attend.
8():
Hexe
And if you had to make 20 beads to accomplish a set of 15 (because they weren't all evenly sized or whatever), you should remember that the set of 15 should cover the time and glass spent on the other 5 that you discarded.
A tip for the newbie sellers (like me) and pricing too low. Now I've sold a few, only a few, beads and I'm thinking my beads are worth more, I've just been asked to make another pair to match a set I sold back in January. The same lady asked for a pair about an month ago, I looked up the original set of 3 lentils (she wanted a pair of the smaller ones) and basically cringed at what she'd paid for the original set as my idea of what my beads are worth had progressed and there's no way I would charge that amount now. So I split the difference between what I think I might charge now and what I charged then and she paid that. Now she's back for another pair for a friend who's seen the original ones and is in love with them.
So beware of pricing too low to start out with (though I'm sure we all do/did, just because it's a confidence thing) for when people come back to you a few months later (when your confidence has grown a bit), because how much can you increase your prices in that short a time?
In doing your calculations I'd be wary of saying you work 40 hours a week realistically I would estimate that in an 8 hour working day you would only be able to do 5 or 6 hours of chargable work, I used to do freelance editing for some journals and could only ever get 5 hours of chargable work done, solicitors do something similar I believe. So be warned I worked out how much I was actually earning I had to double my rate!
Quote from: hexefroschbein on May 27, 2010, 02:28:08 PM
...Keep a spreadsheet...
Put it in a data base - Far easier to manage, and harder to
screw mess up!! Also if your computer crashes far more of it will have been saved! ;)
Cor, this thread has given me loads to think about
So glad (and flattered) that many of you found my pricing article useful.
Lynn, I think you are absolutely right in your attitude - there IS only one Lynn Davy or indeed only one of each one of us. So we should be valued more than factory-made nonsense!
It is hard to put yourself out there though at first. There is the famous great British reserve that holds many of us back.
If someone tells you your work is "too expensive" - well, they are just bloody rude. What business it is of theirs to offer opinion on your pricing if they haven't done the maths?
As kaz says, that is SO different from a person who tells you that your work is lovely just over their budget.
Usually the rude ones are just snidy people anyway and not worth worrying about!
In any event, I would always say NEVER justify or apologise for your prices to customers. Explain your prices by all means if the customer raises the subject - tell the customer that the price simply reflects the time and quality of materials gone into making the piece and use that as a springboard to point out the handmade beads / sterling silver components / hours of beadweaving etc.
Emma
I can't remeber where I got this from, but have found it a useful tool in helping to work out prices. It is a speadsheet thingy put together by a someone called Chris Parry.
I use it and then look at the final suggested price and perhaps make a couple of adjustments. It doesn't take into account factors such as 'what will the market stand?' and 'is this one worth a damned sight more than that 'cos it is just soooooooooo special!'
Follow the link to the blog - http://www.chris-parry.blogspot.com/2007/12/free-spreadsheet-for-pricing-your-work.html
Just fill in the boxes with your info and let it do it's thing.
Be interested to hear what you think of it.
Terri x
Quote from: ejralph on May 31, 2010, 09:16:38 PM
If someone tells you your work is "too expensive" - well, they are just bloody rude. What business it is of theirs to offer opinion on your pricing if they haven't done the maths?
I quite agree, it is rude. I would also like someone to explain why it isn't rude to complain at someone because their prices are too low?
Quote from: Tan on June 15, 2010, 01:44:59 PM
Quote from: ejralph on May 31, 2010, 09:16:38 PM
If someone tells you your work is "too expensive" - well, they are just bloody rude. What business it is of theirs to offer opinion on your pricing if they haven't done the maths?
I quite agree, it is rude. I would also like someone to explain why it isn't rude to complain at someone because their prices are too low?
I suppose thats because generally when you say someones price is too low, it means you value their item - and thats a good thing. Other than all the undervaluing other lampworkers arguments, and taking things stricktly at face value if someone says " you should charge more" its often because the work is simply good and the person passing comment would be happy to pay more, and would like to see the maker rewarded for their good work. Its a compliment :)
Also, don't forget holidays in your calculations... if you work everything out over 52 weeks, that means you will have to work 52 weeks of the year - 48-50 weeks is better, that way you'll be able to take a holiday and know that you're not losing money simply by not producing anything! x
I must admit I sell most of my beads on ebay (about 4 a week!, I'm not exactly going to retire on that) however, I used to always start at 99p but so many people said I wasn't charging enough - if you don't value your work - nobody else will. So now I start at cost of material plus a bit more. I may not get the number of bids but I get my material costs back at very least and most of them sell. My master plan is to get more noticed via ebay as my web site doesn't really get them in. The hits on my site definitely increase when I have stuff on ebay. I have sold my beads all over the world now and hit £20 for 1 bead last week, so really pleased with that one. My client base is slowly growing but it's still only a self financing hobby at this point. It doesn't make it easy for any of us if you charge too little, OK there are the cheap imports to contend with but hopefully there are enough people out there who realise that if they want to create something original and good quality too - they will come to us bead makers.
If you look at the prices people are prepared to pay for a 'Pandora' of 'Biaggi' they shouldn't flinch at paying us a sensible price for our originals.
Quote from: Yellow friend on June 15, 2010, 05:16:35 PM
there are enough people out there who realise that if they want to create something original and good quality too - they will come to us bead makers.
If you look at the prices people are prepared to pay for a 'Pandora' of 'Biaggi' they shouldn't flinch at paying us a sensible price for our originals.
Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Okay, so now that I've started thinking about selling my pretties, I ran into a question :) I would generally price items like I wrote in my earlier post - so that I get a fair hourly wage for making them. But when I started sorting the beads I've made so far I realised that beads that take the same amount of time to make don't always look as "fancy". For example my squigglies are quite fast to make (it takes longer to make the core than the squiggles) but they look much fancier than some dotty beads that take just as long to make. Would you demand more for the "fancy" looking beads than for the "plain" looking beads even if you can make them just as quick?
I have a craft fair on Saturday and am a bit unsure about my pricing, mostly its the same as I put on for last years fairs but i have a board of earrrings and wondered what you sell your earrings at at craft fairs, the same as online or less or more....I was going to make them all at £10, semi precious, lampwork, hoops etc with the larger long earwires at £12, does this seem too cheap...I know its difficult to tell without pics but I have put them all away and its a rotten rainy day so cant take pics. My head feels like it is going to explode thinking about the prices,in a way I would rather sell a wee bit lower rather than come home with a lot, but again dont want to sell myself short. I do try to base my prices on what mostly fhappen members price theirs at though even on here i see there is a huge variation in pricing. This is the local craft association and is good handmade vetted work and is well attended, but it's in a small town rather than the larger town where i was last year and will be again in November. Anyways, any advice, comments most welcome, also, on the brain exploding. :) ::)
Jean, I think simple blanket pricing is a good idea, like you said £10 for one style, £12 for another - but you could maybe add a couple of quid on ;) I totally agree with you about preferring to sell them for a little less rather than overprice and end up bringing them home. You could offer a discount, say buy 2 pairs, get the third half price, something like that.
nora i think the problem is often people dont appreciate or understand that there are so many variables...... some glass is cheeper ,some beads take longer ,some frit is more expensive etc etc etc ....
you have to find a happy pricing balance so it all works out in the end maybe based on size ,type or style ;D
I'm discovering it's a bad idea to price your beads when you're totally skint and Christmas is already a thought paying daily visits to my consciousness. It seems to be making me want to price them cheaper, because of course I'm thinking they'll sell quicker....... resist resist!!!!
I know this is an old thread but one that has made me really think.
How are the 'newbies' who commented originally doing and what advice can they offer now after a few months on?
Ok, here goes the opening of a bag of worms yet again on pricing.
I've noticed recently on Etsy that UK lampwork in particular is getting priced lower and lower. I used to see the odd set here and there priced at below £20, but now it seems very common that I see sets offered for £15, £10 or sometimes even less!
Now, I fully appreciate that it's everyone's free choice what to price their work at, and that some people's work is better quality that others etc etc - that particular aspect of pricing has been debated to death on here in the past.
But it DOES rather beg the question of how to react in response to this general price lowering I've noticed. If you stick to your existing prices, there's the risk that people will stop buying your work (because they can get something cheaper just across the page). But equally I see that if we ALL go around lowering our prices, we'll eventually all undercut each other into non existence...
Thoughts please chaps and chappesses? And remember, play nice in your comments please as I know this topic evokes strong feelings! ;)
I have sets at £10 and at £15. They are the right price for the time they took to make.
I'm more concerned about people selling what is, to my mind, poor quality British lampwork at overinflated prices simply because it's British lampwork. Sharp holes, sloppy encasing, wonky shapes.
That's another can of worms. :D
Indeed Shirley. I have no issue at all with low price beads, if as you say, it's clear that they are relatively simple. That's not the kind of bead I mean though - I'm talking about beads that are obviously quite complex in execution.....
Off now to check for wonky encasing and sharp holes ;) ;D ;D
When I mainly made jewellery from bought beads I used Emma's advice and found it worked well, over time I learned what I could afford to pay for beads to end up with pieces which were likely to sell. Now I am making my own beads I am finding it much harder to price - a lot of my tools I bought before I was selling so did not regard them as part of the business, now they are I am not sure how much to add in and there are just so many more variable to build into the equation!
I just read this article and found it interesting - http://greenwood-carving.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/how-to-price-craft-work-business-advice.html the part about putting your heart and sole into your work really struck a chord!
I've noticed the underpricing issue too, Helen - not a lot you can do about it, as far as I can see :-\
Quote from: Margram on June 20, 2013, 01:14:46 PM
I've noticed the underpricing issue too, Helen - not a lot you can do about it, as far as I can see :-\
I wonder if sometimes peoples own confidence in there own work initiates underpricing, I'm sure it does play a role, esp when you see all the cheap imported beads being sold for pennies :-\
I have just been and lowered all my prices. I haven't sold diddly since Feb. I have tried sales, free postage offers and not a bite.
I don't think there is anything wrong with my beads, in fact, I think some of mine are quite unusual, and I like that! so I guess it has to be the price. There are a lot of us making beads now so competition is tough on us all.
Yep so many people making beads equals a drop in price generally, same with anything really!
This is indeed a difficult one. Here's my twopen'th for what it's worth. Firstly I get really upset with the word hobbyist. If you are making things to sell, then you should be registered to pay tax. If you choose to reinvest all you profits back into your "Hobby" then this is reflected on your tax return when it shows up as a loss. Nevertheless you are a business unless you are giving the stuff away.
I think we all know how to get round the issue with cheap Asian imports. They are what they are "Cheap"! But should also add in their tag "Nasty".
I am really irritated when people sell and undervalue themselves and their art. This is a skill that takes a great deal of time to learn and is a massive investment in equipment and materials. Don't forget that initial investment which is so easy to do by the time you get good enough to start selling.
Yeah, it's OK to have the odd sale, we all have to pay the bills and yes it's tough out there and this type of thing is an impulse buy. But please keep the faith! This is not papercrafting! This is specialized stuff and should be marketed that way.
Rant over ::)
bit of a slur on the old papercrafting there! ::) ;D
Quote from: jammie on June 27, 2013, 10:20:05 PM
bit of a slur on the old papercrafting there! ::) ;D
Lol Jammie that is what I thought :)
Personnally I have just listed my very first set of beads on Etsy/Folksy and am not sure on price but used the formula from the first page I thinkg. I actually spoke to the tax office as I am self employed as a childminder and asked them how it worked with the beads. I was told that unless I expected a profit within the next 1/2 years then it is classed as a hobby and doesn't need to be included on my tax return or need to set up a second account so I haven't. This is just what I was told though.
I have to say I hate the pricing thing as with making Jewellery, lampwork beads and yes cards it is really difficult to price items.
That's interesting Niki as in the past HMRC haven't really recognised hobbies. My understanding was that if you sell your beads at all then they expect you to register as self employed for tax, even if you make a loss. Maybe the rules have changed recently.
Not sure if this helps, it is from HMRC website.
VBNB27000 - VAT Business and Non-Business activities: hobbies
People sometimes have hobbies that involve the making of taxable supplies, for example repairing cars or selling stamps. These supplies are not automatically made in the course or furtherance of business. You should apply the business test.
It is unlikely that hobbies which involve a registered person making minimal supplies are business. However, in some cases the person's hobby can lead them to make substantial supplies and may grow to become a business activity. Many successful businesses grow out of a hobby or private interest.
When judging whether a hobby should be seen as a business activity you should consider whether the activity is taxable for income tax purposes. The Income Tax (Trading and Other Income) Act 2005, Part 2, Chapter 2, Section 5 states that:
Income tax is charged on the profits of a trade, profession or vocation.
This is a similar provision to the VAT definition of business in VAT Act 1994 Section 94(1) which includes "any trade, profession or vocation".
VIT VAT Input Tax VIT44000 gives guidance on situations where people feel that tax paid on the costs of their hobbies may have been incurred to promote or advertise their business.
I phoned up and was told that I had to fill out a tax return, even if I made no profit, that was only last year. Janet
Quote from: JKC on June 28, 2013, 07:15:52 AM
I phoned up and was told that I had to fill out a tax return, even if I made no profit, that was only last year. Janet
Their definition to me, when I asked to call it a hobby as I was working part time and, at that stage, not making a profit for several years was - do you buy in raw goods to sell on as a finished item for more than the cost of the components OR are you just clearing out your hobby box
at cost price so you can make space to make something new but when initially made had no intention of selling, just making for fun. If the former (which I do) then you are a business, if the latter you are a hobby. Since I then made a loss for a few years - had to buy new shedio, old one needed repair etc, and claimed quite hefty losses against my taxed income (the rebate bought my kiln one year!) not once have they said 'not paying you back Mrs, it's a hobby'.
And yes, if you are a business you need to fill in a tax return. It's not difficult if you do it online. Once I have the paperwork together (that's the hard bit for untidy me) it takes no longer than an hour with several tea breaks in the middle.
And if you are a business you need to sort out your self employed class 2 NI stamp - unless you are very successful you can probably get an exemption from paying which you renew as appropriate every couple of years.
The "hobby" issue is a tricky one.
If you are trading as a sole trader and making a loss, then you can offset the loss against other income and so get a tax refund. HMRC don't like hobbyists offsetting losses against the day job year after year and thus paying less tax!!!! Thus they will often ask hobbyists not to file accounts.
HMRC usually look at intention and badges of trade. Are you buying the glass with the intention of making beads to sell? Or do you buy glass to make beads for yourself, and then sell on the ones that you end up not using, and never make a profit?
They don't like to set down a hard and fast rule, as then the tax specialists would use said rule to find a loophole and cook up another tax avoidance scheme!
Well I did my tax return and made a loss for the first two years, and tHMRC never never offered me a refund or a tax code adjustment (I have a full time job and pay tax via PAYE on that)!
Last tax year I made a profit, and now they want their share, which they will recoup via my tax code in the next coming tax year.
On the return you have to complete the box that says "offset against other income". They'll not do it for you as they don't like paying out ;-)
If you didn't do that you should have claimed to carry the losses forward. You then offset the losses against the first profit that you make.
If you've not done either, you can resubmit the last return with amended figures.
Thanks Gaynor, I think I'll just cut my losses and carry on properly from this year. I didn't realise I had to do a stocktake for the first two years either, so had to play catch up this year (hence my impressive profit this year!)
I'm interested to know how you actually do a stocktake - must be a lengthy procedure?
Yeah it is... You basically just weigh everything and then work out the value of everything that way, or work out cost per rod and then count rods per colour and work out the value etc. Frit and murrini are a pain!
Quote from: GlassByNiki on June 27, 2013, 10:53:52 PM
Quote from: jammie on June 27, 2013, 10:20:05 PM
bit of a slur on the old papercrafting there! ::) ;D
Apologies to any papercrafters that I may have offended. That was not the intention. I was a papercrafter for many years myself and did not mean for it to be derogatory to them. I just wanted to use it as an example for the type of investment needed to persue this craft. Yes you can spend copious amounts of money on papercrafting (and I did) but it is not necessary to produce a card. You do not have to invest in £600 for a kiln, rent Oxy bottles whether your using them or not or buy oxycons, torches etc, before you can even consider trying this. And yes the example highlights the ease of learning. I could produce a saleable card quite quickly and quite easily whereas I have invested far more time and effort into producing a respectable bead. (and some may say I'm still not producing a respectable bead). It is easy to take these things for granted and forget them when you are working out you pricing. That's all. Sorry.
(Hangs head in shame) :-*
Quote from: helbels on June 28, 2013, 01:14:21 PM
Well I did my tax return and made a loss for the first two years, and tHMRC never never offered me a refund or a tax code adjustment (I have a full time job and pay tax via PAYE on that)!
Last tax year I made a profit, and now they want their share, which they will recoup via my tax code in the next coming tax year.
You can claim back for the last 7 years. It's a box on the form, something like 'do you want to offset any losses against other income'? I'd give them a call and ask how you go about claiming them now.
Nete I did not take offence at all, sorry if it came across that way hold your head up high and you are definitely making respectable beads x x x
:-*
no offence taken either my comment was more tongue in cheek than peed off no worries! :-*
What would be interesting to know and I am not too sure if it has been posted some where on here, is if there is a 'simple' formula for working out how much propane is used in 1 hour? Would be great to know?
Easiest way to do it would be to weigh a new, full tank, and then work out the cost per gramme or whatever, then use it, and weigh it again at the end of the hour.
It varies according to what torch you use. When I was using a hothead on bulk I used to reckon on around 100g of gas per hour (40 hours from 3.9kg tank). Not tried to work it out on my bobcat but probably a lot less than that.