Hi all, I am in the process of trying to decide which kiln to go for, the paragon fusion 16 or the hobbyfuser, I think the hobbyfuser is a bit bigger but doesn't come with a stand or kiln furniture and its also a few hundred quid more than the paragon ... its my first kiln so I have no idea what I'm doing really :D but I do want something big enough to both fuse and batch anneal beads. I want to be able to fuse plates and bowls ...
So are these two kilns good starter kilns? are they big enough for the things I plan to use them for? Are they easy to use and program? or are there better ones out there I could be looking at for the same money or a bit less?
So many questions .... Thanks to anyone who can give me some advice!
The Hobbyfuser *is* a little bit bigger, but the main differences physically - the Paragon has a brick lid with embedded wire element - the Hobbyfuser has ceramic fibre lined lid with quartz kanthal tubes - which come at a cost.
Advantages? - a brick lid can be at risk of crumbling sometimes, so you could get dust on your work. Changing a tube is apparently easier than changing a wire element - that said, I have had a element lidded kiln for five years and no problem with that element, so I don't think you'd need to worry about that.
The Hobbyfuser is british built - of course, we are one of the most expensive countries to make something in! Paragon is a US company.
Aftercare - well, I've never had a Paragon, so I can't vouch for them, but you'll find a lot of people on here have - good solid reliable kilns. I don't know where you're planning on buying from, but I've had nothing but first class service from Warm Glass UK. However, there are also a helluva lot of very very happy Kilncare customers (including me) who will also tell you that their service is outstanding - second to none (so long as you're willing ot make Lee a cuppa). I wouldn't hesitate in recommending either company personally.
As for are they good starter kilns? I'd say they were 'beyond starter' personally - if you know nothing about fusing, or programming a kiln, then its a big spend for an unknown skill to learn, when you can go and buy cheaper kilns that will do a very good job.
I have reluctantly sold (in process of at least) my Hotstart Pro, been a fabulous kiln. A bit smaller, but a very good starter model I think, and was good enough for the first six months of my business, but I needed bigger. My Hobbyfuser is now at and for my business, so way more than a starter kiln.
Are they big enough? Well, only you can decide how big a plate and bowl you want to make..... but either of those kilns would batch anneal several thousand beads in one go I expect (apparently you can get 300+ in a little bead cube!).
As for programming, I have never tried to program a paragon, but I didn't find it a problem to program my Hobbyfuser (very similar to my Skutt).
Have a read through the past posts, as people have discussed kilns at length, get a feel for what people think of each.
Thanks so much for the detailed reply, that gives me a good insight to the main differences and reasons for choosing one over another - I'll look over past posts as well to get more of a picture - thanks!
I was in exactly the same predicament.
So what Dawn said...plus I think the size you are looking at are kind of life changing in terms of space(may be fine for you, but for me meant creating a much bigger space that I didn't have easily).
So I'm downsizing my expectations and if I outgrow it, I will upgrade :) kilns hold their value in my experience of the lookout, so this is a good choice for me.
Good luck, exciting times eh!
So what did you decide to go for in the end Jeannette?
Skutt hotstart pro for me. But a hobby fuser is my upgrade path if it comes to it.
I am waiting for the big tidy up to be complete in the garage and the workbench to put it on and then I shall be making meltiness! Woop! I hav so many plans ans little glass and kiln space!
I was thinking about the skutt hotstart, but I'm wondering if it'll be big enough for my ambitions ... plates, dishes, vases, tealights ...
I guess it depends how big a plate or dish you want to make..... a plate doesn't *have* do be 38cm....
You can fit a 25cm square in a Pro. Or around an A4 rectangle. Or a 34 cm diameter circle. Of course, you'd get several tea lights in!
For vases, I would suggest you look at the depth of the kilns you are originally looking at - I wouldn't think any of the three discussed here would really be deep enough for a vase.....
I have a hobby fuser, I love it.
I also have a hobbyfuser - and very economical it is to run too. No idea how the paragon compares on that. I know that compared to a ceramic kiln I have the hobbyfuser takes much less electricity and it has an ordinary plug so no need for special wiring.
Well you would get stumpy vases in. There is also another skutt that is square but round plates are no bigger in that one. Remember kilns are hard to come by so will sell well second hand... That's what my long term plan is.
I have hobbyfuser too, love mine. Janet
Quote from: Zeldazog on January 25, 2012, 04:45:39 PM
The Hobbyfuser *is* a little bit bigger, but the main differences physically - the Paragon has a brick lid with embedded wire element - the Hobbyfuser has ceramic fibre lined lid with quartz kanthal tubes - which come at a cost.
Advantages? - a brick lid can be at risk of crumbling sometimes, so you could get dust on your work. Changing a tube is apparently easier than changing a wire element - that said, I have had a element lidded kiln for five years and no problem with that element, so I don't think you'd need to worry about that.
The Hobbyfuser is british built - of course, we are one of the most expensive countries to make something in! Paragon is a US company.
Aftercare - well, I've never had a Paragon, so I can't vouch for them, but you'll find a lot of people on here have - good solid reliable kilns. I don't know where you're planning on buying from, but I've had nothing but first class service from Warm Glass UK. However, there are also a helluva lot of very very happy Kilncare customers (including me) who will also tell you that their service is outstanding - second to none (so long as you're willing ot make Lee a cuppa). I wouldn't hesitate in recommending either company personally.
As for are they good starter kilns? I'd say they were 'beyond starter' personally - if you know nothing about fusing, or programming a kiln, then its a big spend for an unknown skill to learn, when you can go and buy cheaper kilns that will do a very good job.
I have reluctantly sold (in process of at least) my Hotstart Pro, been a fabulous kiln. A bit smaller, but a very good starter model I think, and was good enough for the first six months of my business, but I needed bigger. My Hobbyfuser is now at and for my business, so way more than a starter kiln.
Are they big enough? Well, only you can decide how big a plate and bowl you want to make..... but either of those kilns would batch anneal several thousand beads in one go I expect (apparently you can get 300+ in a little bead cube!).
As for programming, I have never tried to program a paragon, but I didn't find it a problem to program my Hobbyfuser (very similar to my Skutt).
Have a read through the past posts, as people have discussed kilns at length, get a feel for what people think of each.
Dawn...Great reply...do you want a job here at Warm Glass - just the advice we would have given regarding starting out with a kiln!
Quote from: Warm Glass UK on January 27, 2012, 10:42:30 AM
Dawn...Great reply...do you want a job here at Warm Glass - just the advice we would have given regarding starting out with a kiln!
Do I get a staff discount ;) ;) ;) ;)
One day, I *will* make it down to you!
: D Hmmm....maybe not but the other benefits are great down here!