Hi all
I'm sorry if this request covers already covered ground, but here goes:-
I'm a wannabe beadmaker and still dithering between a hot head or going the full hog with an oxycon/nortel minor set up. If I go for the cheap option what won't I be able to do that would be possible with the full monty. Am I likely to get bored within a couple of weeks with the restrictions of my HotHead purchase?
I realise that I will probably make 100's if not 1000's of rubbish beads to start with so is it better to practise with the less expensive set up?
I am a fairly obsessive sort of person, but don't have a vast amount of spare time.
I'm going to Flame Off and hope to have made my decision by then so I can buy all my kit.
Janet
(wannabeadie)
Hotheads are noisy and not brilliant with some of the silver glasses that strike, particularly.
I had a Hothead for just over a year and it was great. I still miss it occasionally, just out of nostalgia! I would say it would be much more than a couple of weeks before you got to feel the restrictions - more like a few months... there are lots of people making fab beads still using a Hothead after some years.
You could always try both at the Flame Off and decide then?
Good question and a good answer, still using HH after a long time, it's not brilliant for really intricate stuff but a great workhorse.
There are things I can't do without a hothead. Lots of effects with silver leaf that I just can't recreate using my bobcat.
The hothead is a great torch for teaching you patience. I used mine for well over a year.
I think that the hot heads are great for starting on - they don't get too hot and give you a chance to get the feel for the glass without it melting too fast. And with some silver glass they're actually work easier for a beginner! You can use it with a bulk set up that you can then just switch over to a dual fuel torch no problem.
You would struggle with really big beads, but then when you're starting out, you're not likely to be making huge beads!! For the price of them, I'd say a HH is a good torch to start on!
I am a totally obsessive type of person, and my completely honest answer is I lasted with my hothead for about 4 weeks, then I couldn't wait any longer and had to upgrade!
I'm not very patient and just wanted to melt glass quicker (and quieter!).
BUT I would still recommend starting with a hothead, because a dual fuel torch and oxycon is a big investment. I would certainly recommend getting the hosing so you can use propane with your hothead though - and you can use the same hosing if you change your torch.
Oops, just read Trudi's answer and I agree with everything she says! ;D
Also depends on your space. I have a hothead and set it up in the kitchen when I want to use it, put it away again in a window seat. Definitely couldn't find the space to stash an oxycon! Definitely not bored with learning after a year, have made quite big beads and hollows etc, slightly annoying that I can't hear the radio while it's on though. Haven't tried a better torch, looking forward to experimenting at the FlameOff.
Start on the hothead with bulk kit and the only money you'll waste if you do get frustrated with it is the cost of the hothead itself and the postage, because you'll use everything else with a bigger torch anyway. (amounts to only about £40). You could probably even sell the hothead on here eventually. Believe me, that extra's a drop in the ocean against all the other money you'll spend on glass and tools!
I've still got my HH and a can of Mapp gas and I'm thinking of selling it at Flame Off! (not really comforatable about posting the gas you see!)
Quote from: shine-on2 on March 22, 2009, 06:21:30 PM
I've still got my HH and a can of Mapp gas and I'm thinking of selling it at Flame Off! (not really comforatable about posting the gas you see!)
Yup I'm selling mine too
http://www.frit-happens.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=11631.0
I think the main fault with the HH is the noise
I've had a HH for a while now. Hadn't used it for about 18 months until I took a class on a Minor/Oxycon set-up in January and was convinced I'd be frustrated going back to the HH. But I was so keen to just get on I did use the HH and have since bought a bulk kit for it. I have been planning to select a "proper" torch at Flame Off (and still may) but I have read recently about a few "proper" bead makers that still use a HotHead - Sarah Hornick is one, and I've seen some great beads on the S&T on here that were made on a HotHead - so I may stick it out a while longer.
I'd strongly recommend getting a HotHead and bulk kit (like may others have suggested) - it really will be just the cost of the HotHead itself that's sort of wasted. But I've read that many people keep their HH as a spare and in case friends come to play.
..or if, like me, you live in a power-cut prone area :)
We've done well this year, but even so there have been a couple of days where I very nearly hooked the old HH up, just to do something while the electric was down...
Yes they are noisy, but on the plus side you can make beads in the same room as a teenager listening to the latest hits. ;D ;D
If you have any doubts about whether a HH is in anyway limiting then (as I was told when I asked the same question) have a look at Sarah Hornik's website. She produces such amazing stuff using a Hothead! http://www.glassbysarah.com/index.html (http://www.glassbysarah.com/index.html)
Some people complain that the HH is noisy. I must say that I don't find the noise to be a problem. I imagine it depends a lot on where you intend to do your lampwork; if you try and use a HH in your sitting room whilst others are trying to watch tv then i can see that could be problem ;D
Roy :)
Holly Cooper also uses a hot head torch... her work is beautiful :O)
http://www.hollycooper.com/AvailableWork
Hey Guys
Thanks for all the diamond input. It definitely looks like the HH is the way forward. Many thanks for sorting me out.
Cheers
Janet
wannabeadie (now gonnabeadie!)
Thanks for that link Les, her work is beautiful!
I would also say, that yes the HH is noisy - however, now that I am more set up - I have the quiet noise of my dual fuel torch, the oxycon chugging away and my overhead extractor going for it - I think all together it is just as noisy!
Lauramay is selling her hot head and bulk connector kit on this thread...
http://www.frit-happens.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=11921.0
Hot heads are great for beginners, they are noisy but they are cost effective, and great to learn how to control molten glass. I had a hot head for years, but started on bulk not mapp gas, I still have my hot head on bulk in the shabbin (shed) at home, for the rare moment i am home and want to make a bead, they only thing that I never managed on a hot head was to get a good result from the silvered glass like double Helix and norstar silvered glass but everything else I managed.
If you really want to pick someones brains phone MARTIN he can talk for England and knows all the pros and cons other than just the cost.
I wont sell my hot head as I still enjoy using it ;D I have nortel minor + oxy con at studio, and about to order another torch for teaching and may even set a hot head up on bulk so students can try the difference (but not my hot head that's mine) wont share the hot head but will share the minor.
Look at the beads you would like to make do these include silver glass? Hope that helps.
Dianne ;D
Hi!
I agree with everything said so far. You can't go wrong with a Hot Head, but:
a) Everything takes longer
b) You can't easily adjust the flame to oxidising or reducing, which makes it more difficult (but not impossible) to do "fancy" glass reactions.
c) It's not hot enough to melt borosilicate glass or to do fusing (where you evaporate gold/silver to get various different metallic effects)
d) It's noisier (although the oxycon partially cancels out the quieter torch)
e) The flame is less well definied, which makes it more difficult to heat just part of your bead.
I was perfectly content with my Hot Head (I've used it for about 10 months), but trying out an oxy torch was a revelation and I don't think I'll use the HH much now I've got an oxy torch.
I got a HH on bulk out in my shed. It is mega noisy, sometimes not as quick as I'd like, but it doesn't cost me much and it just about keeps me sane. :)
my HH and i have been together for nearly 18 mths we are still very happy!!
the best advice i had was go straight to bulk ( you can use the connectors if you up grade to a duel fuel)
its a great little torch for learning the basics which will stand you in good sted .
also you can find out if lampworking is for you without spending out on a oxycon ;)
having said all that i do have a big girls torch and am saving for an oxycon as i feel HH and i have reached the end of our rainbow , i feel i have gone as far as i can,although i will keep it,
as far as what you cant do with it.... toast the top of creme caramels, use it and hear the kids argue (a plus point i find!)
unplug drains or strike raku, tra la
have fun what ever you decide,
sandy x
I still like my hothead despite using the minor burner for about nine years. Had the hothead for about a year when I first started. I still use the hothead - I keep my hand in on it as I teach so it's important to be able to work with whatever torch my students have. I think that if you are good at beads on the hothead you are going to be good on a dual torch. Doesn't often work the other way round. The hothead tends to teach people a certain amount of patience. But then - you tend not to get so many "smeary" beads from a hothead user aswell.
Don't forget - that if you start off on hothead and bulk propane you can use the regulator, flashback arrestor and hosing on the propane side of a dual gas torch so you don't have to spend out on these items a second time if you do decide to upgrade. Don't bother with Mapp gas though. Waste of money.
I like the fact the HH is noisy, as I'm working in the cellar it means if anyone wants me they have to come to me, because I can't hear them yelling down the stairs. It's a great excuse. ;D
Quote from: dangerousbead on March 25, 2009, 11:22:39 AM
I like the fact the HH is noisy, as I'm working in the cellar it means if anyone wants me they have to come to me, because I can't hear them yelling down the stairs. It's a great excuse. ;D
That's true. However, I didn't usually hear them coming and I would jump out of my skin!
True dat
i considered a HH when i very first thought about doing glass , but after i read the cons such as noise and mapp gas prices i was put off . my interest has now been renewed after a chance add of a bead maker on facebook and i am now researching technique etc . while doing this i thought HH would get me up and running quicker , but decided that oxy-con would be bought soon after because i,m not so patient so i,mgoing the full Monty and straight into oxy .
yeah i know its a big investment and yeah i got to wait a while , but it gives me chance to read and hopefully take a class or two along the way . i,m lucky because i already had a hobby room so space isn't an issue also so i figured why not just setup the big boys toy straight off , i know i,m probably mad but what the hey lol
I'm going to repeat my thanks to everyone who has inputted (did I just make up a word?).
I am going to get a HH - having looked at what you clever people can do with it I hope it sets me off in the right direction and allows me a little time to save for the big boys' stuff. At least I will have something mobile to move into the kitchen when my little shed is too baltic to work in!
I live pretty close to Tuffnell Glass so my plan is to go there to buy my kit, and get help with setting up and setting off.
I am really looking forward to seeing some of you at Flame Off. I hope you will be wearing identification - i.e. FH badges!
J x
;D
I'm very happy that I have a hot head when I go and stay with my friend in Australia - in fact I made this bead when I was there in October on the hothead and it is one of the ones I am most proud of:
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s194/kazkebab/AOTM%20photos/CopyofIMG_7000.jpg)
As you can see, working on a hot head allows you to get much more precision in your work, which is helpful for when you upgrade and have to work a lot faster.
The only downsides - noise, speed and a propensity to reduce some glasses (giving a silvery or murky appearance)!
Kazx
If you're going to use Mapp gas in a cannister rather than bulk, you can have my Fireworks torch, it masquerades as a Hothead, has an ignition button, which is useful, but the torch only really works on cannisters, once it's switched to bulk it's as slow as the slowest thing from the slow thing shop. It would be a free start, you could always send it back when you switch.
I love my hot head ;D agree with dangerous bead
Quote from: dangerousbead on March 25, 2009, 11:22:39 AM
I like the fact the HH is noisy, as I'm working in the cellar it means if anyone wants me they have to come to me, because I can't hear them yelling down the stairs. It's a great excuse. ;D
hubby has to flash the cellar lights before he comes downstairs as he's nearly given me heart failure before today, I don't mind the noise, I have all the Harry Potter books on ipod and that keeps me quiet :D
looking forward to trying some different torches at the flame off but actually a bit reserved about changing, I've got very comfortable with my HH :)